== Meeting information == * #ubuntu-meeting: CC meeting Check-In with IRC Council 17:00UTC - Canonical Community Team 17:30UTC, 17 Mar at 17:00 — 18:17 UTC * Full logs at [[http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2016/ubuntu-meeting.2016-03-17-17.00.log.html]] == Meeting summary == * '''Canonical Community Team''' (17:09) ''LINK:'' https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil could be a good start ''ACTION:'' mhall119 to schedule meeting between the Canonical Community Team and LoCo Council, with Community Council invited if desired ''ACTION:'' dpm to pull the various discussion threads about the long-term wiki fix into one place === IRC Council Checking === The discussion about "IRC Council Checking" started at 17:53. === Any other business === The discussion about "Any other business" started at 18:15. == Vote results == == Action items, by person == * dpm * dpm to pull the various discussion threads about the long-term wiki fix into one place * mhall119 * mhall119 to schedule meeting between the Canonical Community Team and LoCo Council, with Community Council invited if desired == Done items == * (none) == People present (lines said) == * dholbach (94) * mhall119 (52) * dpm (48) * popey (30) * belkinsa (28) * mhall119_CCT (16) * sgclark (16) * hggdh (16) * elky (11) * meetingology (10) * Pici (8) * IdleOne (7) * mhall119_cct (6) * mhall119_CC (5) * mhall119_canonic (3) * jose (3) * davidcalle (3) * czajkowski (3) * dax (2) == Full Log == 17:00 #startmeeting CC meeting Check-In with IRC Council 17:00UTC - Canonical Community Team 17:30UTC 17:00 Meeting started Thu Mar 17 17:00:03 2016 UTC. The chair is belkinsa. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. 17:00 17:00 Available commands: action commands idea info link nick 17:00 Who is all here for the meeting? 17:00 #chair mhall119 dholbach 17:00 Current chairs: belkinsa dholbach mhall119 17:02 Anyone? 17:02 o/ 17:03 here 17:03 do we have anyone from the IRC council here? 17:03 #chair sgclark 17:03 Current chairs: belkinsa dholbach mhall119 sgclark 17:03 mhall119, I pinged them on their channel but no one has answered my call. 17:05 I also heard nothing from Canonical Community Team too. 17:05 it looks like they're down to just 3 members after expirations 17:05 aloha 17:05 hggdh: are you around? 17:05 Well, dpm thanked me. 17:05 #chair czajkowski 17:05 Current chairs: belkinsa czajkowski dholbach mhall119 sgclark 17:05 belkinsa, it's in our calendar and we'll be attending 17:06 * belkinsa has a feeling that her e-mail to the IRC Council didn't go through 17:06 dpm, I'm aware of that. 17:06 I didn't realise you wanted explicit confirmation, apologies 17:06 Maybe we could start with Canonical Community Team since you guys are here? 17:06 IIRC, hggdh has setup a poll for voting on new IRCC members 17:06 dpm, not really. 17:07 sorry I'm late 17:07 #chair dholbach 17:07 Current chairs: belkinsa czajkowski dholbach mhall119 sgclark 17:07 It's cool. 17:07 #chair hggdh 17:07 Current chairs: belkinsa czajkowski dholbach hggdh mhall119 sgclark 17:08 ok... shall we start with the Community team then? or mhall119: did you want to talk with just hggdh about IRC things now? 17:08 so it doesn't seem we have any current IRCC members here, nor hggdh, so let's move on to the community team for now 17:08 Let's give a few more minutes to see if someone from IRC Council comes. 17:08 ok 17:08 Alright. 17:09 #subtopic Canonical Community Team 17:09 dholbach: hggdh doesn't seem to be around atm (he'll have lots of nick highlights when he get back now :) ) 17:09 What are your updates? 17:10 are we starting with the Community Team now? 17:10 Yes. 17:10 dpm: popey: davidcalle: balloons: our turn 17:10 * mhall119 trades hats 17:11 o/ 17:11 Hi everyone 17:11 ok, so we have a few topics we wanted to talk to the CC about 17:11 o/ davidcalle 17:11 mhall119, the mic's yours. 17:12 #1 We want to focus more on LoCo Teams than we have in the recent past, and we really need active help from the LoCo Council on this 17:12 things like planning global jams and promoting release parties are things that, in our view, the LC can be taking a lead on, rather than us 17:13 sorry, am on a hangout 17:13 I generally like the idea... what kind of things would the LC do then? 17:14 I am now in, had a conflicting meeting 17:14 in my mind, they would handle the regular events like Global Jam, Release Parties, etc. Setup the event in LTP every cycle, contact loco teams to encourage them to participate, promote loco activities when they do participate, etc 17:15 we've also got a global Meetup.com account now that loco teams can use, and the LC has been given the authority to grant access to that for teams, so we would like to see that promoted among them 17:16 maybe we could start collecting ideas among all LoCo teams and start discussing them at UOS, so we could see which of them are doable - maybe the LC could then help tracking this? 17:16 maybe there could be some LTP <-> meetup integration as well 17:16 +1 17:16 so, to bring it back to action items, is the CC generally in favor of the LC becoming more proactive in growing the LoCo community, and will you help us encourage them to do so? 17:17 We can do this. 17:17 one approach to this could be to have a conversation with the LC and see if we can update their charter together 17:18 +1 17:18 +1 17:18 o/ 17:18 and review the current expectations 17:18 sorry, had to go afk 17:18 is that charter somewhere online that prospective new LC members can see? 17:18 mhall119: so one thing I think would benfit some locos who've had it hard is to ope up meetup to them for new blood 17:19 not sure who is asking form whom here, but seems to be a good plan forward to me. +1 17:19 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil could be a good start 17:19 czajkowski: yup, and we have that option now, we just need to get the news out to those teams 17:19 sgclark: I'm asking on behalf of the canonical team 17:19 Oh. I was lost too. 17:20 sorry, many hats gets confusing :) 17:20 it's a bit confusing as mhall119 and myself are both on the CC and the Canonical Community team :) 17:20 It's cool. 17:20 ok 17:20 there we go :) 17:20 nice one 17:20 yes, I also feel the LC focusing more on these activities might also be more rewarding work for them than doing team verifications 17:20 only it truncated it 17:20 mhall119_canonic: fantastic news 17:21 dpm, and it would probably make it easier to get others involved who are willing to help 17:21 in that case I will take an action item to arrange a call between the canonical community team and the LC 17:21 mhall119_cct, maybe see if some CC members are interested too 17:21 all won't be able to make it anyway 17:22 ack, I will email the LC and CC lists together 17:22 but it might be good to look at the charter and the general list of ideas together and see what's doable and what might be too much 17:22 I sent an e-mail with the instructions to manage the global meetup account and add new teams to the LC in private (it included password info) a while ago, but I can put that on the wiki or somewhere else too if it makes more sense 17:22 #action mhall119 to schedule meeting between the Canonical Community Team and LoCo Council, with Community Council invited if desired 17:22 * meetingology mhall119 to schedule meeting between the Canonical Community Team and LoCo Council, with Community Council invited if desired 17:23 dpm, do you feel there was a bottleneck in getting the meetup accounts set up? 17:23 well, the meetup.com interface and process was....not fantastic 17:24 mhall119_cct, totally agreed 17:24 ok, if that helps - sure 17:24 but I think with documentation and the LC's help, there's nothing preventing teams from signing up 17:25 dholbach, it's a bit cumbersome, but just another mechanical process, not intuitive, but easy to grasp once you've done it a couple of times 17:25 ok 17:25 ok, we need to move on to our other topics if the IRCC is going to have any time this hour 17:26 dpm: did you want to talk about the doc team? 17:26 sure 17:26 * mhall119_CC changes hats again 17:26 sure 17:26 I have mostly a short update 17:27 we proposed some dates for a meeting 17:27 and looking at doodle, it's most likely to be next Thursday 17:27 background for this is https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-community-team/2016-March/001104.html (for those who are not on the community team list) 17:27 just to give some context 17:27 as it's the date all interested participants so far seem to be available 17:28 thanks Daniel 17:28 for context, this is about the docs team's request to find someone to step to into a leadership role to help them made decisions 17:28 heh, dholbach beat me to it 17:28 great 17:28 I think having a meeting together is going to be a good start 17:28 +1 17:28 +1 17:28 we'd be happy to help, and we have some suggestions, but we'd like to better understand their needs from the team first-hand to see where we can contribute 17:29 rather than coming up with a grand plan upfront 17:29 I think this is a sane approach 17:29 thanks a lot for looking into this 17:30 are these all of the topic you wanted to bring up? 17:30 nope, one more 17:30 more of an update really 17:30 because I think it'd be nice if you could give an update of what the Canonical Community team is currently looking at, at least what the big blocks are and what's coming up in the future 17:31 so the wiki had been the target of spam starting a couple months ago 17:31 and if we don't have enough time, we should probably make some - even if we schedule another meeting 17:31 ok 17:31 and as a result IS locked it down so it oculdn't be edited 17:31 sounds good, I can do that after mhall119_CCT's update 17:31 same with help.ubtunu.com/community 17:31 thanks dpm 17:31 mhall119_CCT: fyi, you're spamming every channel you're in with these nick changes 17:31 the docs team asked for help unblocking them on this 17:31 just put CC: or CCT: in front of your text 17:31 ok 17:32 so after a few failed attempts to get the wikis back to normal editing mode, we ultimately ended up with a solution where edit access is restricted only to a specific Launchpad team 17:33 We also discovered two more wikis which were spammed 17:33 ubuntu-women and upstart 17:33 ~ubuntu-etherpad was chosed because (A) it's already used for spam-control on the etherpad, (2) so many people are already a member of it and (3) we've been good at quickly adding new members when they request is 17:33 do you still know where this was announced? 17:33 so IS had made the changes to wiki.ubuntu.com and help.ubuntu.com/community to implement this change,and it seems to be working for the most part (login is still slow) 17:34 dholbach: announcing anti-spam methods tends towards spammers working around them. 17:34 popey: are those wikis changed to use ~ubuntu-etherpad now, or are they still open? 17:34 mhall119_CCT: they are now 17:34 we let the docs team know about the change, and I believe they've been letting others know when needed 17:34 popey, right... I just started thinking about how many people we might probably lock out 17:34 well, u-w is, i think upstart was just frozen initially given nobody really needed to edit it 17:34 just a minor detail, but would it make sense to rename ~ubuntu-etherpad to something more generic? 17:35 not if the long term goal is to replace the wiki 17:35 it might make sense, but it would require some investigation into the impact a rename would have 17:35 and, as popey said, this isn't hte long term fix, we still need to do something else 17:35 yes 17:35 this was just a short term fix to ensure people could get on and use the wiki as it was designed 17:35 but, I wanted to give the CC and update on the status of that, as it was brought up in the checkin with the docs team 17:35 do we know IS' stance on a long term plan? 17:36 we don't have a plan yet :) 17:36 no, I think pleia emailed them asking about some options, but I don't think she's heard back yet 17:36 ok, that's all I had 17:36 last nick change, I promise popey :) 17:37 :) 17:37 * mhall119 forgets not everybody has those messages hidden by their IRC client 17:37 ok 17:37 I think using u-etherpad was a good idea and it's probably not many who are locked out of the wiki today 17:38 we have had people drop by #is and ask why they can't edit 17:38 but not many people 17:38 and we fixed it promptly by telling them what team to join 17:38 <3 17:38 there were also some cases where people's accounts were flagged as spammers during the incidents, and IS had to do something extra to allow them to edit again, but it wasn't many that I've seen 17:39 Also, note that -etherpad team contains others which makes the impact lower 17:39 ok, if it hadn't been obvious enough, I think we need to pull all the threads together and come up with a plan 17:39 so if you're in ~ubuntumembers you're already good 17:39 or locoteams 17:39 or, several other temas 17:39 more people have been inconvenienced by the "logout/login / refresh / refresh" dance in my opinion 17:39 yay cache 17:39 just a heads up, I sent an email to elmo several days ago to ask about some wiki stuff, and the plan I had to try and migrate it to mediawiki or something else is still running 17:39 * jose hides again 17:40 we should co-ordinate that jose 17:40 jose, it might be worth putting the plan (ironically) in the wiki 17:40 the long term plan is also going to be dependent on getting a leader on the docs team to make final decisions around it 17:40 hm 17:40 hehe, sure. I wanted to work on a timeline but until we don't get that reply back from elmo we're basically locked 17:40 I wouldn't say it's the whole responsibility of the docs team 17:40 because right now the docs team can't come to an agreement on what to move to 17:40 sorry, *sole 17:41 dpm: no, but for help.ubuntu.com/community at least it's primarily them 17:41 is there a mailing list where we could involve more IS people? 17:41 I agree, but that's a subsection of the wiki 17:41 I'm sure some of them will have looked at other wikis 17:41 I think it's a completely separate wiki, actually 17:41 looks like moin's last release was in 2014 17:42 mhall119, ah, that might well be 17:42 ok, any other topics from or for the canonical community team? 17:42 ok, what action do we take from that topic? 17:42 * Poke IS 17:42 * Come up with a high level plan 17:43 * Make sure community people aren't blocked from editing current wiki ? 17:43 I think the meeting with the docs team is a good next step 17:43 I was expecting some "??? PROFIT" in there, but yeah - sounds like a good plan 17:43 Docs team and IS I think are top priority 17:43 but I think we need to start working on the plan regardless 17:44 I think growing leadership will be something that we can fix, but it will be a matter of weeks/months 17:44 dholbach: I prefer 🎈 🎈 🎈 PARTY! 17:44 :-) 17:44 :-) 17:44 is there a doc anywhere listing the various options and their pros/cons? 17:44 I'm happy to start pulling the threads together and work with jose, IS and other folks who have looked at this before and document it 17:44 probably should be, there are about 100+ threads on the subject scattered about 17:45 +1 17:45 awesome 17:45 yay, thanks dpm 17:45 #action dpm to pull the various discussion threads about the long-term wiki fix into one place 17:45 * meetingology dpm to pull the various discussion threads about the long-term wiki fix into one place 17:45 ok 17:45 \o/ action items! 17:46 great, thanks a lot 17:46 I've got a topic I didn't add to the agenda, but just been reminded about it from jose. Shall I go for it, or is there anything else someone wants to talk about before? 17:46 * mhall119 is done 17:46 feel free 17:46 ok 17:47 so just an update that thanks to the good work jose has been doing, Ubuntu will have a booth at OSCON 17:47 woohoo! 17:47 nice one 17:47 oooh 17:47 related to that, the community leadership summit 17:47 🎈 17:48 reminder: OSCON is in Austin Tx this year, not Portland Or 17:48 boooo 17:48 :-) 17:48 evidently Portland was too hot :) 17:48 lol wut?! 17:49 so, IRCC still in? 17:49 I've talked to some of you before, but I've been looking to send most of the community team to the event this year, and I think we should have funds in the community donations to sponsor interested members of the CC 17:49 sgclark: oh right, you were in Europe I think, there was a heatwave during CLS/OSCON, it was actually hotter there than in Florida 17:49 oh ouch. 17:49 I'll follow up with an e-mail to the CC with the details, but that's the gist of it 17:50 very nice :-) 17:50 sorry, to clarify "to send most of the *Canonical* community team this year", as last year it was mhall119 and I 17:50 Yeeeee-hawwwwww! 17:50 ok thank you 17:51 have fun :) 17:51 sgclark: can you not make it? 17:52 I am poor :) 17:52 alright. An update on the IRCC: elections were planned for after end of Feb; Flannel requested to run them (I was originally going to) 17:52 sgclark: that's what community donations fund is for :) 17:53 "we should have funds in the community donations to sponsor interested members of the CC" 17:53 thats you sgclark :) 17:53 #topic IRC Council Checking 17:53 dpm, do you (or anyone else from the Canonical Community team) still have a quick update on what the current big blocks and what the upcoming big blocks are going to be? :) 17:53 I can have a go at it 17:53 I think that'd be nice for folks reading the log afterwards 17:53 hggdh: has the poll been created and sent out? 17:53 because that's what's usually part of our catchups :) 17:54 mhall119: nope, current plan is on/before this Saturday, I believe 17:54 mhall119: no. Flannel told us he has been buried, and that he should be setting Condorcet this weekend 17:54 is it the full council up for election, or just some open seats (and if so, how many?) 17:55 there are 3 open slots: Pici, Tm_T, and myself are ending our run. 17:55 The Canonical community team will start laying out the next cycle in the next few weeks, also to align with what other Canonical Ubuntu teams are working on, so while this is not set in stone, I'm thinking of these big blocks for the team to focus on next cycle: 17:55 - UbuCons and LoCo teams 17:55 - Snappy developer growth 17:55 (I'm slightly here, going into another work meeting in 5 minutes) 17:55 - Unity8/convergence outreach 17:56 offifially Tm_T and myself has already have our memberships in the IRCC team expired 17:56 hggdh, should we extend the term lenghts by a few weeks to make the transition smoother? 17:57 dholbach: I think it would make sense. I did that for us once, and so did Pici. But now I am expired, and cannot change it anymore 17:57 and of course we'll continue working on phone app/scope development outreach, but as more and more of the different technologies are starting to converge (pun intended), all these threads will be coming together 17:57 I'll do it 17:57 done - that should give you enough room to organise things now 17:58 on other news: the IRCC has have a series of ops candidates to review and ack/nak. 17:58 dpm, thanks a lot for the update 17:58 no results have been posted out yet. 17:59 if nobody has any other questions for the Canonical Community team, I think we can let them go now - sorry for the somewhat confused meeting and waiting time today. 17:59 none here 17:59 hggdh, is this part of a regular check or did this have any other reasons? 17:59 * mhall119 has nothing more 17:59 we were scheduled for a checkin if that's what you're asking 18:00 elky: i think he means the ops appt thing 18:00 dholbach: I am not sure this would be a regular check; I am just writing out what I had 18:00 ah ok... now I understand - thanks hggdh 18:00 welcome elky :) 18:00 we hi 18:00 hi 18:00 I thought this was something like ops' membership expiring which triggered a review 18:00 but this is actually for new ops, right? 18:00 hi elky 18:01 ok, thanks everyone! 18:01 * dpm calls it a day today 18:01 yep, new ops 18:01 yes we are reviewing the backlog of "can i be an op" requests from launchpad. 18:01 thanks dpm, popey, davidcalle, mhall119 and balloons :) 18:01 ok, got it 18:01 how are thing apart from that in IRC land? :) 18:01 Thanks all :) 18:01 o/ 18:01 quiet mostly which is nice. 18:01 that sounds good :) 18:01 Now everyone moved to Slack ã‹› 18:02 haha 18:02 thanks dholbach too :) 18:02 and the new ops have all been contributing for a while, so they're known faces? 18:02 biggest drama is probably the bit where we had to set registration restrictions on offtopic to stop an inappropriate user 18:03 other than that it's been quiet and calm 18:03 that's good to hear 18:03 other than the council elections, is there anything the Community Council can do to assist you? 18:04 the candidates list has the usual mix of long-term users, new users, and power-seeking ones 18:05 I really like how professional things are, like channels for upcoming events like UOS or the release party or whatever - it all works and things are just seamless 18:05 so big thanks for all that 18:06 ah... one question I always have: did you approve some new "ubuntu irc members" recently? 18:07 or are new contributors encouraged to apply for membership at all? 18:07 They are encouraged, but we haven't had anyone new lately. 18:07 ok 18:07 (also no one showed up to my work meeting, so here I am) 18:07 :-) 18:08 and how's the atmosphere among the ops and helpers generally? are things quiet and relaxed there too? 18:08 it's us against them 18:08 according to them 18:08 who against whom? 18:08 and why? 18:08 We had once... incident... recently, (and by recently I mean the last few days), so we're still working on triage and cleanup from that. 18:08 dholbach: the "good" users never see us 18:09 But otherwise things have been quiet (imo) 18:09 the other users they fight 18:09 I'm sorry, I'm not sure I understand 18:10 who feels they fight whom and why? 18:10 dholbach: the atmosphere is good except for the few problem users. 18:10 I should have been more clear, sorry :) 18:10 he's saying that the users who we interact with with ops hats are usually people who misbehave. 18:10 ok... and they are the regular trolls in high-volume channels or somebody else? 18:11 the users who behave well don't even know we exist for the most part 18:11 ah ok, now it makes more sense :) 18:11 *phew* 18:11 ok... do you have any big things still on your TODO list? 18:11 or stuff which still needs to be decided? 18:11 other than those things already discussed, nope 18:12 at least not that i've been made aware of 18:12 ditto 18:12 +1 18:13 ok 18:13 that all sounds good - thanks a lot everyone for your hard work 18:14 sgclark, mhall119, belkinsa, czajkowski: did you have any more questions? 18:14 not I 18:14 or hggdh (with some head swapping)? :) 18:14 sorry, HAT swapping 18:15 heh 18:15 no, I am good 18:15 * sgclark giggles 18:15 ok cool 18:15 in that case: thanks a lot everyone for coming 18:15 thanks everyone 18:15 and thanks everyone for making Ubuntu a better place :) 18:15 thank you. 18:15 we're slightly over time already, but does anyone have any other business they urgently wanted to bring up? 18:15 #topic Any other business 18:16 (and thanks for the bots!) 18:16 :) 18:16 All rightie... looks like we're all done! 18:16 thanks everyone! 18:17 #endmeeting Generated by MeetBot 0.1.5 (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology)